Proffered once before at the dawn of Mutant Sounds in its original LP incarnation by Jim, it seemed crucial to share the deeper mysteries of one of France's most radical and profound voices once more with the contents of this vastly expanded double CD reissue of their second outing, now that this version is out of print. Ilitch was Thierry Mueller plus guests and his approach heard on 10 Suicides (as opposed to their more atmospheric and Fripp-damaged debut) is precisely situated between the acid prog synth meltdowns of Verto/Spacecraft/Heldon/Lard Free on one end and the synth punk-esque attack of Metal Urbain and Lucas Trouble on the other; a particulaarly nerve shattering and spellbinding place to locate an aesthetic. 10 Suicides is expanded and enriched by the inclusion of the 12 minute CD capping and narrative laden oddity "Culture", but it's the second disc of bonus goodies in particular that will prove a real boon for seasoned psychonauts, culling together as it does both the original full 16+ minute version of the atmospheric Comma Programma (sections of which were originally excised and used as fragments on 10 Suicides) and, more significantly, offering up 35+ minutes of re-titled material first heard on their impossible to find Eurock cassette-only release P.T.M. Works that harks back to their Periodik Mindtrouble debut, but takes it much deeper into vertigo-inducing, Lard Free-damaged and phaser-queased kosmiche ends. Absolutely crucial!
Note: links removed at the request of the artist
Thankyouthankyouthankyou!
ReplyDeleteI wish I'd bought this when I had the chance more than 10 years ago - have been looking for a copy to buy ever since, with no luck.
best wishes
Chris
This is about to reissued according to Thierry from Ilitch. Might want to take it down.
ReplyDeleteanonymous-Is there some sort of confirmation of that that you can provide? I've visited both the Ilitch website and Mueller's myspace page and neither mention anything about this prospective reissue despite updates on both that are as recent as December 2010. I couldn't find any such info anywhere else either...
ReplyDeleteThis is my ethical thought. Maybe i'm old fashion but i'm made like that.
ReplyDeleteMusic is a work, material is expansive and every work must be paid.
I don't live with my music, i don't sell a lot of record, i have to work hard to have the possibility to make music and i don't like people give what is not theirs.
If all people give my work, one day i can no longer produce my music.
i know it's a new trend with Internet but i really not agree.
A lot of people did that but i have some precept: i don't give things that do not belong to me and i don't take (in this kind of circumstance : free download) what it don't belong to the people who give.
When i like a music i buy the record or i legal donwload.
Same with my friends : i buy their records or i exchange because same as me they need it
For me it's the same thing if i told someone : "goes to this person, take what you want, i give it to you"
it's not my way of life!
When i want to offer something, I offer something that is mine or i bought
For exemple, why people will buy the reissue of "10 suicides" if they can have it free.
You don't give free the records you made to anyone! you will can no longer have your work and do your passion
Sorry that ugly diatribe falls on you but for me it's a very sensible point and it makes me out of me.
Please if you can take off these downloads, it will be nice.
Sorry again
All the best
--------------------------------------
Thierry Muller
9, rue Charles Tellier
94400 Vitry-sur-seine
contact@ilitchmusic.com
http://www.ilitchmusic.com
Sorry Thierry...links have been removed. No offense was intended.
ReplyDeleteEric
LAME! When will these guys figure out that this is a way for them to sell records that they could not have sold before. This does the artist good! DUH
ReplyDeleteI didn't know this artist. Well I'll never know him now.
ReplyDeleteAnd yes, I download and buy cds afterwards. But never before trying. And that behaviour makes me not want to try :)
Forgotten artists tend to think this "new internet trend" is taking money away from them, when in fact it is literally the only way for them to reach an audience. Long forgotten artists (Poeme Electronique for example) have been rediscovered through internet sharing and are now releasing old material, playing live, and making that precious money on their new releases too. It saddens me to hear that some people can't grasp this due to fear, ignorance, or ego.
ReplyDeleteMine, mine mine! All MINE!
After reading the great review of the Ilitch '10 Suicides' album I was really looking forward to hearing it...anything that provides a sonic link between Heldon and Metal Urbain is of interest but like the posters above point out, there is a good chance I will never hear it now and like the poster above I am now accustomed to hearing before buying.
ReplyDeleteI really do appreciate what the artist Thierry Muller is saying because it is based on a belief system that the digital copy is identical to the artefact itself.
Ontologically speaking, the map is not the territory, the menu is not the meal and the MP3 is not the record or CD.
While a few of the 70s/80s generation of "obscure" artists embrace the new economic and cultural model such as Doug Lynner of the Moebius & Lem album cult fame who was very happy that Mutant Sounds posted his album and was glad that there was interest in an album he made in 1979 and is long out of issue (though fingers crossed it will be reissued soon), many still have the idea that its the economic equivalant of bootlegging an LP or CD and passing it off as the original.
I hope Thierry Muller reconsiders taking the links down because the reality is the complete opposite to what he assumes....far from hurting sales of the reissue, a post on Mutant Sounds will increase sales...the more people who hear the album, the more it will sell and vice versa...the less people hear it, the less it will sell to put it country simple.
Perhaps as a compromise Mutant Sounds could post a MP3 rip of one of the CDs or a few tracks of their choice....just a thought!
If you all are supposedly downloading this album just to sample it, I don't know why you need it in its entirety including the bonus material. A cursory Google search led me to 3 tracks from this album available on You Tube. Anyway, Thierry has been making amazing music for 4 decades now, I'm sure he will do fine with out your "support".
ReplyDeleteSorry guys, I do not want to enter into this controversy. I will do not convince those who do not want and I think I have already said what I thought.
ReplyDeleteI read some interesting thoughts, others what I can not agree and some that I find hypocritical.
I just ask a few questions among many:
What percentage of people who download and buy the record after?
Who needs to download an entire album to see if it is interesting and if he will buy it? Will he buy it as he had it in full?
Would you like to support musicians like me and labels like BlRR or not?
When there will have no more small labels that produce discs like mine, you will listen to what? The soup of the majors? because majors will still be there!
What about the sound work, if it is to listen to music with the lousy sound of MP3s?
Why do graphic work, sleeves, booklets ...?
Why do musicians - among other artists - should give their work? Give yourself your?
What percentage is up to the musicians on the sale of a disk?
Do you honestly believe that I have win lots of money since I make music? If it can reassure you, I spend more to do it than I won!
The list of questions could be long ...
I'll just ask one more question on this record:
How do you think it was sold of "Ilitch-10suicides" since 1980 (LP, CD included) world wide?
I offer a "10 suicides"(from its reissue on Beta-lactam Ring Records) to the first five people who will find the answer.
Remember to put your name.
Many thanks to people who like my music and support me in bying records
Sorry for my bad english writting
All the best
Thierry Müller
Hi Thierry, I just want to say that I was able to download this album before the link was taken down, and because of this I have listened to your album in its entirety (how I feel an album should be heard), and in doing so it has prompted me to purchase the physical copy off of Eurock.com
ReplyDeleteHowever trying to stop the downloading of your album on the net is the equivalent of stoping the resale of your album through used record stores, or cassette trading or so on and so forth.
Trust me your music is worth the purchase tag, and I'm glad I've heard it, but this website is predominantly visited by true record collectors that would I'm sure, 90 percent of the time, purchase any album featured that isn't OOP. I have done this with a Makers of the Dead Travel Fast album that was posted here last year.
Bottom line: I understand where you're coming from, as a musician myself it's not always in my best interest to give my music away to people, but at the end of the day it's the only way I can really feel satisfied as an artist. Sharing music is what this site is all about, and I hope you could reconsider, but if not I respect your opinion, and hope you continue making these excellent fried sonic jams.
-Myles
dear thierry,
ReplyDeleteyour big long posts on this subject are extremely boring and 10 years too late. sorry guy, you lost me.
hey anonymous,
ReplyDeletefuck off. thierry has every right to sound off what he thinks in a post that offered a free download of his album.
it's been really interesting to read these thoughts. like he said, there's no debating going on. this (free music sharing) topic is not going to be solved in a blog posts' comment section. time will
If a record is really good, and the physical item is deluxe or vintage / coveted, people will pay out the ass for it.
ReplyDeleteThis is the new paradigm - since anyone can hear it, it becomes a symbol of status (authenticity even) to have an expensive, well packaged, signed, limited edition or mega rare copy of the real thing - even more-so now than before downloading was a concern.
I suggest any obscure artists try putting their dollars into a limited run of deluxe reissues and get ready to make more money than they ever could through a regular re-issue (which, frankly, is a waste of your time and resources).
Downloading can not be stopped - in fact, this late in the game, if no one is downloading your record - that's a really bad sign for you as an artist.
As this is the reality, the best defense is to use download sites as free publicity and use the comment sections to feed your record to the collectors - they NEED the real thing to feel whole!
Let's be honest - very few of the artists on Mutant Sounds could sustain much of a living off their music in the their time. Cutting off one of the venues to a larger audience than you've ever had access to is not helping you at all. Of course it is your right to do whatever you want with your music and, of course, I respect that.
My 2cents.
Guys, Thierry's site has a great selection of samples for you to try out before buying (wish all artists would do this). Under the Discography section click on each album cover,
ReplyDelete10 Suicides: http://www.ilitchmusic.com/01pages/music/10sui_cd.htm
I'd also personally recommend his "Rare and unreleased 1974-1984" - it's fucking beyond amazing!
http://www.ilitchmusic.com/01pages/music/rare_unreleased.htm
Thierry please do another similar compilation to 1974-1984, I'd love to hear more of the stuff from the "Ilitch Tapes" !
Salut Mon Pote,
Rupert P.
Myles - good luck buying it from Eurock, because they haven't actually had it for years (unless you're saying they will be stocking the new reissue, and as far as I know they don't sell cds anymore). In my decade or so of trying to find a copy of this CD, I contacted Eurock a couple of times about it because their website kept coming up whenever I searched with google. The Eurock guy has assured me they haven't had the cd for sale for a long time and google linking to an old page is a mistake.
ReplyDeleteI also tried e-mailing Fractal Records (who did this 2-CD reissue) many times over the years to ask about this CD and if it will ever be re-pressed - and they never replied, not once. I think I may have also tried contacting Mr Mueller through his website a couple of times [this was years ago, so not entirely sure] and also didn't get a reply.
So, I can hardly be blamed for requesting the upload and leaping on the chance to download this when it came. I've been chasing it for so long and it never showed up anywhere that I looked.
I'm indeed glad it's being reissued again, and I respect Mr Mueller's wishes to not have this free download up anymore, but if there had been any advance warning of another reissue (I think I last checked the Ilitch website a few months ago and didn't notice any mention) I would have just waited for it to come out. If people want folks to buy their music, a bit of communication would be nice when they ask about trying to buy it when something has been totally unavailable for sooo long. I've lost track of how many artists I have e-mailed over the years, asking when or if some old rare album of theirs will be reissued, and never got a reply. I was willing to buy this cd for a long time and just got sick of waiting, all indications seeming to suggest that this first reissue was all we would ever get! I mean, I never even saw it turn up on Ebay, though I wasn't checking every day for the last decade.
Will the new reissue include all the bonus material, or like many re-reissues will it revert back to just the album itself with no extras (or different extras?).
Chris
Well, I'm not one for Cd's. If I download an album that's long out of print and love it and it gets reissued on Vinyl, I will buy it for the physical/tactile satisfaction and the audiophile quality and pleasure of listening to it on my Analog system. Since I have gotten deeper into listening to rare music thanks to blogs like Mutantsounds I have expanded my record collective to an obscene level. This is lust one paradigm on how free downloads lead to extensive purchasing of music(some used but plenty of reissues). There is so much great music out there that has not seen the light of day till these great bloggers have started sharing their collections and knowledge. Frankly, this is the greatest aspect of the internet, sharing information. And it's equally great that the Artist can communicate in near real time "hey please don't distribute my music for free". What a great time to be alive and to be an artist.
ReplyDeleteYes, I'm a bit worried my CD has not come in from Eurock but everything was processed. Now that you say they don't have the CD in stock I'll have to contact them. This is quite frustrating. I'm glad I came back to check on these comments.
ReplyDeletei've somewhat recently found this blog through the FM Shades blog which is also amazing, but no longer being updated. I would like to give a big thank you to the mutant sounds crew. Since finding this blog I have discovered the Vas Deferens Organization, which to this day is the most similar music to what I make that i've ever found. That being said I have discovered countless musicians through these sites. there is a website called www.gemm.com they have almost everything. you can find a lot of the stuff on these obsure blogs for sale there. im a little late into this convo. but seriously, if you love to make music as I do you should think of it as a gift to the people of this planet. I never have and never will charge anyone for my music, because it is basically my diary, as i assume is the same for many musicians. i dont do much and dont have much to offer but I will always work a regular job to fund buying more equipment for my musical creations. and to say that you owe it to me to pay me for my music is superficial and frugal. i do it because i love and have to, and to charge people for it is pathetic, because i will be doing it anyway. i will work hard to make my own money so that i can continue to make music, and i dont think it is right to say that you owe it to me to buy my records. they would have been made anyway with or without anyones support. so all in all, I think that thierry has a twisted view of his place in this musical community. boss up and realize your potential! i mean come on, do you really think that you are going to get a cut of your record or cd sales which are obviously only desired by the obscure music community, and sold by small dealers around the world. NO! you are barely making any money from these random sales, and to say that we owe it to you so that you can keep making music?? people like this are people who want to sell out but cant. if you make music as passionately as you claim to do then you will make it whether or not you get album sales. wake up. the world is ever-chaning and you cannot stop it.
ReplyDeleteHi, I write a french message for Thierry.
ReplyDeleteBonjour Thierry, je ne doute pas que tu sois de la meilleure des volontés, tout comme Mutantsound qui a sans-doute boosté ta diffusion. (Des dizaines de milliers de personnes sans doutes, dont moi, vont être amenés à apprendre ton existence et à découvrir ta musique.)
Je fais moi-même de la musique depuis les 80's mais je diffuse gratuitement à moins qu'il ne s'agisse d'un ojet cd (auparavant k7). Je ne compte pas gagner ma vie avec la musique donc je ne risque pas qu'on me coupe les ponts à défaut de rentrées.
Je voulais mettre l'accent sur le fait que si "tout travail mérite salaire", ce qui a été produit il y a 30 ans n'est plus de nos jours ce qui réclame ta concentration et ton talent. Ton travail actuel par-contre peut directement dépendre de si "oui ou non" tu es soutenu. Il faudrait normalement être rétribué en temps réel comme créateur et non à postériori comme marchand mais tout ceci ne dépend unilatéralement de personne. Le système entier est mal-foutu, complètement inadapté au nouveau média et n'encourage en rien la mise à l'oeuvre (la preuve: te voilà occupé à traquer tes vieux travaux sur le net au lieu de de t'afférer à la création de nouveaux!)
J'espère que ceci t'apparaisse comme une remarque plutôt que comme une critique et trouve dans l'ensemble ces échanges très fair-play.
Bonne chance, je file découvrir le site ...
jp
Monsieur Muller.
ReplyDeleteJe voudrais participer au concours : Gagnez un cd de Ilitch. Je dirais que vous avez vendu des millions d'exemplaires jusqu'au début des années 2000, quand le téléchargement est apparu, et puis plus rien.
J'ai raison ?
Pyrrhon
Cher Pyrrhon,
ReplyDeleteSi tu avais raison, ce que j'aurais bien aimé, il n'y aurait pas eu cette décision donc pas ces messages précédents aux quels, pour certains, je ne répondrait pas (À quoi bon essayer de convaincre, sans prétention, des gens qui ne regardent que le bout de leur pied !!!)
Donc désolé, mais t'as tout faux.
Mais comme tu est le premier qui a répondu à la question, envoie-moi ton adresse par mail par mon site : www.ilitchmusic.com
Bien à toi
Thierry
Blah blah blah...can someone just reup this in the comments section already :)
ReplyDeleteno, someone can't just reup this - buy the cd when it's out and shut your blah blah mouth.
ReplyDeleteApparently this isn't happening, finally broke down and bought a beat up vinyl copy I found listed on discogs.
ReplyDeleteThierry is offering this album as a digital album now on Bandcamp:
ReplyDeletehttp://www.ilitchmusic.com/
I think these blogs do a great service to discovering new music. What concerns me is when folks don't pay the creator. Food isn't free.
Merci Thierry pour ce magnifique lien sur Bandcamp.
ReplyDeleteTout le monde y trouvera son compte maintenant.
Bravo pour ton œuvre...et vive les godmichets.